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leardriver
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PostPosted: 31 Jan 2008 4:51 pm 
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Personally, I believe there are significant differences between Sherman and Callahan. We better hope so. Still, it's interesting to see what the competition thinks of our coaching change.

Bill, '67
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PostPosted: 31 Jan 2008 5:03 pm 
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Paper thin drivel. I got to the bottom and expected a page 2. I am sure any of us on AgTimes.com could whip up a blog on something like "Why would you hire a guy you passed on the first time?" or "Beware of nomads who hail from the midwest" or "Why hand over the reins of a storied program like Nowledge University to someone who has never been a head coach...at any level?"
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aglaw01
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PostPosted: 31 Jan 2008 5:06 pm 
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One thing this guy would never admit to is that Nebraska's talent is shoddy at best, and likely will be for the foreseeable future. With Prop. 48 gone, so is Nebraska football. Funny how he mentions the LAST year of the Sherman Green Bay era, but not the others. Whatever...
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mpaul MR Member
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PostPosted: 31 Jan 2008 5:21 pm 
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I think any objective observer of college football and football generally knew that Callahan was a disaster of a hire from the start. First, he was not their first, second, or even third choice, if I remember. Second, Pederson disregarded 50 years of NU football tradition when he showed Solich the door, throwing the culture of the program into complete disarray. Third, they had a well-established system that they just chunked.

About the only thing in common is that they were both NFL head coaches. Evern there, one had consistent success, the other was hired by Al Davis. 'Nuff said.
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KJN86
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PostPosted: 31 Jan 2008 5:53 pm 
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aglaw01 wrote:
One thing this guy would never admit to is that Nebraska's talent is shoddy at best, and likely will be for the foreseeable future. With Prop. 48 gone, so is Nebraska football. Funny how he mentions the LAST year of the Sherman Green Bay era, but not the others. Whatever...


Tom Osborne saw the writing on the wall and got out while he was on top. I agree with the Prop. 48 part of your post.
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PostPosted: 31 Jan 2008 8:36 pm 
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One thing this guy would never admit to is that Nebraska's talent is shoddy at best, and likely will be for the foreseeable future.


I haven't updated my data for 2008, but 2005, 2006, & 2007 Rivals' data shows Nebraska recruiting better than us (although we certainly aren't the gold standard for recruiting). They haven't kept up with the horns and okies, but they did hold down 3rd place in the B12, if you put any stock in Rivals.
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Ag1985
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PostPosted: 31 Jan 2008 8:57 pm 
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Callahan was an obvious misfit, a desperate choice of last resort.

Sherman is a good fit and a first-tier choice. No comparison.

However, I do acknowledge some concern about the "West Coast" offense. It seems so '80s. What other good college team is running it?
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rainag
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PostPosted: 31 Jan 2008 9:06 pm 
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cal I believe as well as oregon state. I will be a difficult task for the QBs but it will be very good for the offensive players.
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rtank87
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PostPosted: 31 Jan 2008 9:11 pm 
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Nebraska has been recruiting.. I keep hearing that John Blake is a great recruiter. Stoops had a lot of success with the OU talent he assembled. I have talked with a couple players from tu now in NFL that told me their grandma and mom are still mad at them for not going with John Blake.
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rtank87
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PostPosted: 31 Jan 2008 9:14 pm 
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Husker people should compare Fran to Callahan. Coming in and not adapting to fan base or culture. That is the issue not NFL versus College. imo
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TraderAg MR Member
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PostPosted: 31 Jan 2008 9:30 pm 
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We'll have the last laugh when it all shakes out on the field.

I think Pellini will probably do a good job and embrace their traditions, as Sherman will.

I just happen to think Sherman is a proven HC, whereas Pellini isn't.

You really never know how a coordinator will make that transition to ultimate taskmaster from being merely a cog.
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Shelby
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PostPosted: 31 Jan 2008 11:58 pm 
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I'm not sure why anyone would be upset about this article. I think the writer makes some credible points.

There will most likely be some growing pains while installing the West Coast O. I've seen it argued that this O does not fit in college ball due to the limited practice time.

And while we're all hopeful this will turn out to be a great staff, clearly one third of our current staff are the ones who evaluated, recruited, developed, and coached the train wreck at Nebraska.

I can certainly understand a Husker fan's opinion.
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jamey MR Member
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PostPosted: 01 Feb 2008 12:10 am 
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I don't know that's it's possible to take an entire NFL offense and place it in the college ranks due to time constraints but any scheme can be trimmed down and simplified
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PostPosted: 01 Feb 2008 12:35 am 
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And there, again, the comparison might be apt between Callahan and Fran. Was Callahan too stubborn to adapt his coaching style from the NFL with all its practice time available (and more mature and motivated personnel [$])?

Although I will say this, even Nebraska fans should recognize that their offense was more diverse and put up some good numbers - especially with their 05, 06 QB and our current grad. assistant.

I think with Rossley and Sherman's son-in-law working with our QB's, we have a chance to pick some version of the West Coast offense up a bit more quickly.

Besides, the West Coast offense is more a philosophy than a single scheme and set of plays. You adapt it to your personnel. If you have the big back and good runners, you run more and add more play action. Then, the quick, short passes just set your running game up all the more.

If you have great receivers, you spread the field and try to hit quick passes to receivers in space, or more of the bubble screens and spread offense-type stuff to get more one-on-one match-ups with your bigger, faster WR's on smaller DB's. One broken tackle and good things are going to happen.

So we'll have to wait and see what a Sherman-led offense will look like. Sherman's biggest challenge, but also perhaps his own personal best strength, is going to be coaching the O-line up to pass protect better and be more successful zone blockers on the run.

Another comparison between Callahan and Fran was that both seemed to recruit and place their best athletes on offense. It was the collapse of the defenses at schools with very proud defensive traditions that doomed both guys - although the rejections or aloofness toward the history and traditions of the programs certainly didn't help both guys.
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PostPosted: 01 Feb 2008 8:45 am 
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We will just have to wait and see, won't we?
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PostPosted: 01 Feb 2008 8:49 am 
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Good points, Rev, but this one really nails it:

Quote:
Another comparison between Callahan and Fran was that both seemed to recruit and place their best athletes on offense.


If anything, we Aggies pride ourselves on defense, and for a coach to ignore that legacy is an affront to the school's heritage. And this in no way is to impune the Aggie D players we have right now (or the Husker players, for that matter)... it's just simply the original focus of the coaches that's in question.

Think about it... of all the Big 12 schools, which ones have/had such national exposure on their defenses that nicknames were created? The only two I know of are "The Wrecking Crew" and "The Blackshirts." True, other schools have fielded solid defenses, but to garner a nickname reflects the heritage and pride that the school places on that part of the game of football. I would submit that both Callahan and Fran failed to fully grasp that part of the equation.
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spanielboy
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PostPosted: 01 Feb 2008 9:19 am 
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One thing this guy would never admit to is that Nebraska's talent is shoddy at best, and likely will be for the foreseeable future.


I think just because the Corn had a bad season for the 2007-2008 campaign, it is not indicitive of their talent level over the last few years. It hasn't been shoddy, but one where the 'plug-and-play' system just flat out broke down. I am going to post the NFL draft selections for Nebraska. How has A&M fared with Coach Fran over the same time?

In continuation of 4um's post above, below are both Scout's and Rival's rankings of the various classes from 2003 to 2007.

2007 Scout (NU 21 A&M 26) Rivals (NU 13 A&M 43)
2006 Scout (NU 29 A&M 21) Rivals (NU 20 A&M 27)
2005 Scout (NU 10 A&M 17) Rivals (NU 5 A&M 8)
2004 Scout (NU 38 A&M 14) Rivals (NU 27 A&M 13)
2003 Scout (NU 28 A&M 9) Rivals (NU 42 A&M 10)

I will say that I am really getting tired of Nebraska fans observations - if it isn't Callahan it is either the hiring of their former assistant coaches or picking up their recruits. Pellini may very well be the coach for them, but they think we are on our way to the crapper a bit too easily.

Secondly, Sherman isn't Callahan. Callahan had come in and changed everything to make NU football in his image. Sherman is doing the opposite. Callahan went 180 degrees to go from Power-I to the WCO (with all of its nuances and motions). Sherman will scrap the zone read and go to pro-set balanced scheme that will continue to use the run. There was a thread a couple of weeks ago where a fantasy football analysis looked at what Holgrem and Sherman run the WCO -- and there is a huge difference between Sherman and Callahan.
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PostPosted: 01 Feb 2008 9:26 am 
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If anything, we Aggies pride ourselves on defense, and for a coach to ignore that legacy is an affront to the school's heritage.


No doubt that both Nebraska and Aggie fans wanted a more dynamic offense while not letting the defensive heritage slip away. Both coaches chose the first at the expense of the second.
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Agdad78
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PostPosted: 01 Feb 2008 9:28 am 
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Concerning the article itself, if I had an agenda, or if I had a complaint, I could turn Mother Theresa's good works into a what a "load of uselessness" slant. (And there are people on this site that could put me to shame on doing this, too...)

Sure, everything he wrote has a certain amount of validity to it. Especially if each is taken seperately. Callahan was a jerk and Fran was aloof. Both thought they could win their way. Neither got the enire package of the team right.

You pick Sherman's last year at GB...they just had a rash of very key injuries. The players didn't give up on him. Callahan was universally hated in Oakland. The fans, the players and Al Davis...(Well, two out of three ain't bad... Wink ) Ask Lechler...

Sherman is nothing even similar to Callahan. The situation in CS is not similar to Nebraska. The expectations are entirely different within the fan bases. The history is different. This is a guy tarked about what Osbourne saw coming and looking to comfort himself with a comparison to another school. It ain't all Callahan's fault that Nebraska dipped so far. It's rules that go against their previous strengths that play a significant role. Now they have to decide if they will cheat like ou to get back...instead of the legal working the system they used to do...

There are questions to be answered in CS. To some, maybe it is the first loss or worse, the first 3 and out. Maybe it is the first year of Big 12 play and the '09 recruiting class. The rebuild is not nearly as formidable as the one Fran faced, so I believe there is hope earlier...

But ultimately, the W's and L's will tell the story.
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PostPosted: 01 Feb 2008 12:08 pm 
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Shelby wrote:
I'm not sure why anyone would be upset about this article. I think the writer makes some credible points.

There will most likely be some growing pains while installing the West Coast O. I've seen it argued that this O does not fit in college ball due to the limited practice time.

And while we're all hopeful this will turn out to be a great staff, clearly one third of our current staff are the ones who evaluated, recruited, developed, and coached the train wreck at Nebraska.

I can certainly understand a Husker fan's opinion.


This doesn't make a lot of sense. Nebraska's problem was not its style of offense. Even with the poor performance of their transfer QB this past year, they finished #9 in the nation in total offense(#14 in 2006). It was their #112 defense that was the problem.
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PostPosted: 01 Feb 2008 12:34 pm 
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Dang, I hate to agree with jamey on anything, but I made his exact point to some buddies of mine as a point of concern I had and they just shrugged it off and put on the maroon glasses. I do think it's an issue.
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PostPosted: 01 Feb 2008 1:33 pm 
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I read somewhere ... from an NFL coach, I believe ... that the spread can be very simple if it is boiled down to a few running and a few passing plays.

There was also an article on Callahan, when he was first coaching at NU about how complicated the play book was for the QB to learn.
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MechAg94 MR Member
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PostPosted: 01 Feb 2008 2:41 pm 
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As I have heard, a simple play book is exactly what Tech does and they seem to do very well on offense.


I agree with others. It wasn't the offense, but the defensive performance that really got under people's skin.

For Fran, Defense started the pot banging, but I think for some it was the inconsistency of the offense (Fran's offense) that put the nail in the coffin. At least one person I know who didn't like the bad mouthing of Fran saw the tu game and agreed with the sentiment of "Where was this all year?".
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PostPosted: 01 Feb 2008 2:47 pm 
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MechAg94 wrote:
As I have heard, a simple play book is exactly what Tech does and they seem to do very well on offense.


I agree with others. It wasn't the offense, but the defensive performance that really got under people's skin.

For Fran, Defense started the pot banging, but I think for some it was the inconsistency of the offense (Fran's offense) that put the nail in the coffin. At least one person I know who didn't like the bad mouthing of Fran saw the tu game and agreed with the sentiment of "Where was this all year?".


Taken a step further, to the Penn State game, it appeared that Fran was not the problem with play calling after all. Darnell let Les call the offense against PSU and it didn't look anything like the dominant offense that was called against tu.
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PostPosted: 01 Feb 2008 2:51 pm 
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From wikipedia ... west coast offense ...

Quote:
At the college level, LaVell Edwards and Dewey Warren created an offensive system similar to the West Coast Offense at Brigham Young University (BYU) in 1973[2] This offense culminated in a NCAA Division I-A national football championship for BYU in 1984 and a Heisman Trophy for Ty Detmer in 1990. BYU broke over 100 NCAA records for passing and total offense during Edwards' tenure. Several coaches and players associated with BYU's football program had success with this offense at BYU and elsewhere including: Mike Holmgren, Andy Reid, Brian Billick, Ted Tollner, Doug Scovil, Norm Chow, Jim McMahon, Steve Young, Ty Detmer, and Steve Sarkisian among others. The reason for the success in this version of the offense is that it cuts down on complexity. Norm Chow says offenses have around 12 basic pass plays and 5 basic run plays (with screens)--those plays are run from many formations, with plays tagged for a little versatility, so that the players know the offense by the second day of practice. Former Pittsburgh and Stanford head coach Walt Harris also used a variation of the West Coast Offense during his stint at Pittsburgh.

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jamey MR Member
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PostPosted: 01 Feb 2008 7:33 pm 
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Big Bucks wrote:
Dang, I hate to agree with jamey on anything, but I made his exact point to some buddies of mine as a point of concern I had and they just shrugged it off and put on the maroon glasses. I do think it's an issue.


Be careful, I'm contagious! Laughing
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